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VenomLand :: Viperidae :: Agkistrodon
 

 Help for ID

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+2
Predrag Ristic
Rémi Ksas
6 posters
AuthorMessage
Rémi Ksas
Snakekeeper
Snakekeeper
Rémi Ksas


Number of posts : 77
Age : 46
Location : France (near Paris)
Points : 5854
Registration date : 2008-10-04

Help for ID Empty
PostSubject: Help for ID   Help for ID Icon_minitimeSun 4 Sep - 22:52
Hello,

I need help to identify this snake.
The lines on the head are like on A. taylori but the coloration of the body is really light (this snake is about 55cm).
And the number of sub-caudals is too high to be A. taylori. According to Campbell & Lamar, the females A. taylori have 40-47 subcaudals. This snake is a female and has 52 SC.

An Agkistrodon bilineatus bilineatus? (according to Campbell & Lamar, the labials lines don't correspond).


Help for ID 2711S

Help for ID 2798S
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http://www.lancehead.fr
Guest
Guest




Help for ID Empty
PostSubject: Re: Help for ID   Help for ID Icon_minitimeSun 4 Sep - 23:13
Hi,

As we already talked about it, it's quite a good clue to have a good identification of this specimen. I can't wait to have some others point of view.

Kind regards
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Predrag Ristic
Snakekeeper
Snakekeeper
Predrag Ristic


Male
Number of posts : 93
Age : 50
Location : Serbia
Points : 5417
Registration date : 2010-01-20

Help for ID Empty
PostSubject: Re: Help for ID   Help for ID Icon_minitimeSun 4 Sep - 23:37

I would say, Agkistrodon bilineatus russeolus...
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Rémi Ksas
Snakekeeper
Snakekeeper
Rémi Ksas


Number of posts : 77
Age : 46
Location : France (near Paris)
Points : 5854
Registration date : 2008-10-04

Help for ID Empty
PostSubject: Re: Help for ID   Help for ID Icon_minitimeSun 4 Sep - 23:52
Predrag Ristic wrote:

I would say, Agkistrodon bilineatus russeolus...

thanks for your opinion. An american herpetologist (who worked on Agkistrodon) told me the same (without certainty).
But I think the labial lines are different on russeolus, isn't it?
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http://www.lancehead.fr
Rémi Ksas
Snakekeeper
Snakekeeper
Rémi Ksas


Number of posts : 77
Age : 46
Location : France (near Paris)
Points : 5854
Registration date : 2008-10-04

Help for ID Empty
PostSubject: Re: Help for ID   Help for ID Icon_minitimeMon 5 Sep - 0:15
A picture of the full body

Help for ID Fullbody
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http://www.lancehead.fr
Peter van Issem
Serpent Chief
Serpent Chief
Peter van Issem


Male
Number of posts : 707
Age : 57
Location : GERMANY
Points : 6429
Registration date : 2009-03-08

Help for ID Empty
PostSubject: Re: Help for ID   Help for ID Icon_minitimeMon 5 Sep - 2:10
Hi Rémi,
I guess - maby a mix will be my first choise of all possibilitys. Between bilineatus & taylori
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Alexander Nevgloski
Newbie
Newbie
Alexander Nevgloski


Male
Number of posts : 31
Age : 56
Location : United States
Points : 4735
Registration date : 2011-08-21

Help for ID Empty
PostSubject: Re: Help for ID   Help for ID Icon_minitimeTue 6 Sep - 8:00
The first photo looks like A. taylori to me, and the others suggest possibly a cross (as Peter noted) or possibly a hypomelanistic A. taylori
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Mats Jonsson
Snakecharmer
Snakecharmer
Mats Jonsson


Male
Number of posts : 149
Age : 57
Location : sweden
Points : 4904
Registration date : 2011-08-04

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PostSubject: Re: Help for ID   Help for ID Icon_minitimeTue 6 Sep - 15:11
Alexander!
I think its the same snake on all 3 pictures. If im not wrong here..
reg
Mats
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Rémi Ksas
Snakekeeper
Snakekeeper
Rémi Ksas


Number of posts : 77
Age : 46
Location : France (near Paris)
Points : 5854
Registration date : 2008-10-04

Help for ID Empty
PostSubject: Re: Help for ID   Help for ID Icon_minitimeTue 6 Sep - 15:31
yes, Mats is right. It's the same snake.
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http://www.lancehead.fr
Mats Jonsson
Snakecharmer
Snakecharmer
Mats Jonsson


Male
Number of posts : 149
Age : 57
Location : sweden
Points : 4904
Registration date : 2011-08-04

Help for ID Empty
PostSubject: Re: Help for ID   Help for ID Icon_minitimeTue 6 Sep - 16:59
Rèmi!
Can you provide more information about the parents of this snake!
do you have them?
pictures of the parents?
I also put my money on a cross breeding of billineatus x taylori
reg
Mats
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Rémi Ksas
Snakekeeper
Snakekeeper
Rémi Ksas


Number of posts : 77
Age : 46
Location : France (near Paris)
Points : 5854
Registration date : 2008-10-04

Help for ID Empty
PostSubject: Re: Help for ID   Help for ID Icon_minitimeTue 6 Sep - 17:13
this snake is probably from wild. It is a customs seizure in suitcase of a passager from Mexico.
So I haven't more informations.
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http://www.lancehead.fr
Alexander Nevgloski
Newbie
Newbie
Alexander Nevgloski


Male
Number of posts : 31
Age : 56
Location : United States
Points : 4735
Registration date : 2011-08-21

Help for ID Empty
PostSubject: Re: Help for ID   Help for ID Icon_minitimeWed 7 Sep - 9:20
Yes, I believe them to be pictures of the same animal, it just that the first photo looks more taylori than the others do. Sorry for the misunderstanding.
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Gavin Carpenter
Snakecharmer
Snakecharmer



Male
Number of posts : 138
Age : 65
Location : South Africa
Points : 5994
Registration date : 2008-04-03

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PostSubject: Re: Help for ID   Help for ID Icon_minitimeWed 7 Sep - 12:43
It looks very much like a hypomelanistic Taylori. I have some of them and the color and pattern are the same.

Cheers
Gavin
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