From Switzerland

"In my residential area" sounds a bit different now - compared to one of your first postings here:

Quote :: It is far from easy to obtain a license to keep venomous snakes in Switzerland.
You'll need to take training courses for both, theory and handeling.
Then you'll need to pass both examinations (theory/handeling)
Then you'll need to pass your snake room examination from the veterinary services.

Only then you can start to keep venomous snakes of the 1st from 4 categories of venomous snakes.

This could easily be understood the way that these lists are valid and used generally in Switzerland.

Peter, we all know you don't like lists....
I'm conserned by your constent will to try to prove that you're right.

If you'd knew something about Switzerland's geography, cantons and politicals you wouldn't have quoted this.

But I guess when it comes to you, we could say: Haters gonna hate...

Quote :: If you'd knew something about Switzerland's geography, cantons and politicals you wouldn't have quoted this.

good one! I've been born in Switzerland and lived there for 43 years before i left my country in 1995.

It's actually not me who must be right, but the forum. VenomLand stands for factual and reliable informations.

Try to get not too personally, please. That's another benefit VenomLand stands for.

Hello Brian,

I know that that list is applied in your area - and just in your area.

But as written, this is not an official list from the Federal Veterinary Office in Bern. This means, that this list is not used everywhere in Switzerland. Or how I can start with some "Cat. 3" snakes?

In fact to ask for a keeping licence officially in Switzerland you need:

- proof of expertise - theoretically or/and practically
- liability insurance proof
- safety concept
- Membership in a Serum depot
- list with the species you wish to keep

That documents you send then you your Cantonal Veterinary Office and after a control of the responsible Person in your room, you will receive the keeping licence (if everything is ok of course). And you have to pay a fee.

If Peter likes lists of not is not the point - I think that you and the other keepers in your area are not happy too with it...

And Peter is a Swiss, so I think he knows a bit something about our beautiful country Wink

Best regards,

Michael

Sorry Michael, but membership to a serum depot is not needed anymore in most cantons in Switzerland, Validated by Federal Veterinary Office in BERN on October 2014 and by Central Toxicology Office.

I'm very happy with having a list here.
If you started directly with a cat 3 snake without prior experience with venomous snakes I'll find the regulations in your Canton a bite light.

No offense to that, I'm sure you proved to be able to-do it.But for me it's like motorbike license. Going from a bicycle to a 1000cc sportster is surprizing without prior experience with a 125cc.

Stay safe

Hello Brian,

Thats new for me. In the Animal Protection Order ("Tierschutzverordnung" in German) on the hompegage of the Federeal Veterinary Office is it still listed under Point 23) and for me that list is authoritative - do you have any paper / information about this?

Even if it's no longer needed, I think a Membership in a serum depot is a good/important thing and you do that for your own and not for somebody else..

That regulation in my canton are the regulation which are normally used in Switzerland and are listet in the Animal Protection Order, so that has nothing to do with "a bit light".

I worked nearly 3 years with venomous snakes, before I ask for a keeping license and feel ready for it, otherwise I would not done it like this.

The comparison with the motorbike is not 1:1 applicable, every Person has some other skills. Some can work better with Crotalids, other better with Elapids and so one. In my view ist it definitely easier to handle a Naja then a Rattlesnake, but thats really a personal Thing..

Best regards,

Michael

Very interesting point you have there,

Here is an extract (in French, sorry ...) of the Federal Veterinary Offices, (Information 800.109.07 - Animal Protection Law) :

BVET wrote:: 6 Recommandations pour les mesures de sécurité

63 Si des antidotes spécifiques peuvent être obtenus dans le commerce (se renseigner au Centre suisse d’information toxicologique à Zurich, tél. 01-251 51 51, www.toxi.ch), ils doivent être à disposition dans un délai utile après un accident dû au poison. On peut imaginer les possibilités suivantes :
a. Les antidotes sont tenus prêts par la pharmacie cantonale. Les détenteurs d’animaux venimeux peuvent, le cas échéant et dans le cadre de leurs autorisations, être tenus de verser une contribution financière à la constitution du stock.
b. Plusieurs détenteurs d’animaux venimeux peuvent se regrouper et exploiter un dépôt central (chez un médecin ou un pharmacien).
c. Dans le cadre de son autorisation, le détenteur d’animaux venimeux est tenu de garder lui- même en stock les antidotes.

In substance, this article says the following :

a) Serums are kept in Cantonal Drugstores. Venomous animals keepers can be asked, in regards to their authorization, to contribute financially to keep serum stocks.
b) Several Private Keepers can regroup and exploit a central stock (at a physician or pharmacist)
c) Depending on its Authorization, the keepers can be asked to keep his own serum stocks.

So for instance here in canton "Vaud/Waadt" they use part of the charge of the authorization to contribute to serum stocks held at the CHUV.

Your case is a bit different. You already had worked for 3 years with venomous snakes (which in case of canton Vaud is qualifiying for cat 3). But if you had no previous experience with venomous sankes, would the veterinary office in your canton have granted you with a license for a Naja ?

I'll take a guess and would imagine that you are keeping Naja naja, naja kaouthia or naja haje ?

Kind Regards,

Brian

Here are the links to the papers on the website of the federal veterinary office :

Regarding access to serums :
http://www.blv.admin.ch/themen/tierschutz/00781/00786/?lang=de

Document is : 800.109.07 art 63

Point 23 says :

Quote :: 23)
Falls für die gehaltenen Arten verfügbar, müssen Antivenine (Seren) vorrätig gehalten oder über die Mitgliedschaft in einem Serumverein leicht zu beschaffen sein.

Implementation according to BVET :

Quote :: 63 Soweit spezifische Antivenine im Handel beschafft werden können (Auskünfte über Schweize- risches Toxikologisches Informationszentrum, Tel. 01-251 51 51, www.toxi.ch), sollen sie innert nützlicher Zeit nach einem Gifttierunfall greifbar sein. Denkbar sind folgende Möglichkeiten:
a. Die Antivenine werden von der Kantonsapotheke bereitgehalten. Die Gifttierhalter können allen- falls im Rahmen ihrer Bewilligungen verpflichtet werden, einen finanziellen Beitrag an die Lagerhaltung zu leisten.
b. Mehrere Gifttierhalter können sich zusammenschliessen und eine zentrale Lagerhaltung (bei einem Arzt oder Apotheker) betreiben.
c. Der Gifttierhalter wird im Rahmen seiner Bewilligung verpflichtet, die Antivenine selbst an Lager zu halten.

Kind Regards,

Brian

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